Covid vaccine personal experiences

[RickD]

Only a nut would think the Covid vaccines alter your DNA.

I wouldn’t say that necessarily. If shown evidence that Covid vaccines don’t alter dna, and they still believe, then that’s bordering on nutsville. Just like the nitwits that still believe Covid vaccines are safe, when there’s plenty of evidence that says otherwise. Those people live on the border of Nutsville.

I wouldn't be so quick to say that mRNA vaccines don't change your DNA.

Here's Moderna's chief medical officer Tal Zaks at a TED talk who says that mRNA vaccines will alter your DNA. I don't think it is the Covid-19 vaccine that he is referring to but ones they are working on, so it could be future vaccines for Covid variants or future virus' that are just as deadly or worse.

Scroll down for the video.

https://sonsoflibertymedia.com/bombshel ... lters-dna/

I watched the video multiple times, and I never saw where he said the vaccine changes dna.

[Stu]

Only a nut would think the Covid vaccines alter your DNA.

I wouldn’t say that necessarily. If shown evidence that Covid vaccines don’t alter dna, and they still believe, then that’s bordering on nutsville. Just like the nitwits that still believe Covid vaccines are safe, when there’s plenty of evidence that says otherwise. Those people live on the border of Nutsville.

I wouldn't be so quick to say that mRNA vaccines don't change your DNA.

Here's Moderna's chief medical officer Tal Zaks at a TED talk who says that mRNA vaccines will alter your DNA. I don't think it is the Covid-19 vaccine that he is referring to but ones they are working on, so it could be future vaccines for Covid variants or future virus' that are just as deadly or worse.

Scroll down for the video.

https://sonsoflibertymedia.com/bombshel ... lters-dna/

I watched the video multiple times, and I never saw where he said the vaccine changes dna.

In the video at some point they show the DNA with a little red piece indicating that it is defective, he says that they want to change that.

[RickD]

Only a nut would think the Covid vaccines alter your DNA.

I wouldn’t say that necessarily. If shown evidence that Covid vaccines don’t alter dna, and they still believe, then that’s bordering on nutsville. Just like the nitwits that still believe Covid vaccines are safe, when there’s plenty of evidence that says otherwise. Those people live on the border of Nutsville.

I wouldn't be so quick to say that mRNA vaccines don't change your DNA.

Here's Moderna's chief medical officer Tal Zaks at a TED talk who says that mRNA vaccines will alter your DNA. I don't think it is the Covid-19 vaccine that he is referring to but ones they are working on, so it could be future vaccines for Covid variants or future virus' that are just as deadly or worse.

Scroll down for the video.

https://sonsoflibertymedia.com/bombshel ... lters-dna/

I watched the video multiple times, and I never saw where he said the vaccine changes dna.

In the video at some point they show the DNA with a little red piece indicating that it is defective, he says that they want to change that.

He’s talking about changing mRNA, not dna. Hence the name mRNA vaccine.

[DBowling]

Here's a quick comparison of the death rates of those catching the Covid-19 virus and those receiving the Covid vaccine.

A. Covid-19 mortality rate.
The number of Covid-19 cases in the US to date is 29.4 million cases
The number of deaths in the US associated with Covid-19 is 534 thousand.
534,000/29,400,000 = .018
==> the death rate in the US for those catching the Covid-19 virus is 1.8%

B. Covid vaccine mortality rate
According to the CDC
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7008e3.htm

During December 14, 2020–January 13, 2021, a total of 13,794,904 COVID-19 vaccine doses were administered in the United States; 8,436,863 (61.2%) doses were administered to women. VAERS received 6,994 reports of COVID-19–associated adverse events during this period. Among all reports, 6,354 (90.8%) were classified as nonserious and 640 (9.2%) as serious, including 113 (1.6%) deaths. The median age of vaccine recipients in VAERS reports was 42 years (range = 15–104 years); 5,505 (78.7%) reports were submitted for adverse events in women. Headache (22.4%), fatigue (16.5%), and dizziness (16.5%) were the most frequently reported symptoms after vaccination with either vaccine (Table 1). Sixty-two reports of anaphylaxis have been confirmed, 46 (74.2%) after receipt of the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine and 16 (25.8%) after receipt of the Moderna vaccine.

VAERS received 113 reports of death after COVID-19 vaccinations; two thirds of these deaths occurred among LTCF residents. All-cause mortality is high in LTCF populations because underlying medical conditions are common. Based on expected rates of background mortality, among the approximately 1 million LTCF residents vaccinated in the first month of the U.S. COVID-19 vaccination program, approximately 7,000 coincidental, temporally associated deaths from all causes would be expected during the analytic period (7). In contrast, VAERS received 78 reports of death after COVID-19 vaccination in LTCF residents, and approximately one half were in residents who were in hospice or who had a do-not-resuscitate status. Reported causes of death in LTCF residents after COVID-19 vaccination are consistent with expected all-cause mortality in this population. Among deaths in persons with available death certificate and autopsy information who were not LTCF residents, causes of death were consistent with background all-cause mortality and did not indicate any unexpected pattern that might suggest a causal relationship with vaccination (8).

From 12/14/2020 - 1/13/2021...
The number of Covid-19 vaccinations in the US was 13.8 million
The number of Covid-19 vaccination related deaths was 113
113/13,800,000 = .0000082
===> the death rate in the US for those getting a covid vaccine is 0.00082%

So let's compare:
Death rate in the US from the Covid-19 virus = 1.8%
Death rate in the US from the Covid-19 vaccination = 0.00082%

And since the death rate from the Covid-19 vaccination is consistent with the all-cause mortality rate, this indicates that there is not even a demonstrable cause/effect relationship between the Covid vaccine and these 113 deaths.

All of which demonstrates that it is orders of magnitude "safer" to get vaccinated for Covid-19 than to do nothing and catch the Covid-19 virus.

[RickD]

DBowling,

As we’ve already discussed, your numbers are flawed in at least two ways.

1) positive cases cannot possibly account accurately for asymptomatic people, and people with mild symptoms, who were never tested. This would actually make the Covid positive cases much higher than your numbers, thus lowering the mortality rate in your study.

2) the death rate doesn’t differentiate between people who died from Covid-19, and those who died with Covid-19.

And there is another issue that we need to address. It’s the issue of whom is classified as a death from the Covid vaccines. Many deaths happening after vaccinations are not attributed to the vaccine.

And my contention that the vaccine is not safe(protection from risk; not causing harm) isn’t limited to deaths and “serious” side effects, however those are classified.

This is the misinformation that I talked about before, that you continue to perpetuate.

And for the life of me, if you are seeking the truth, I don’t know how you could still promote this misinformation in your arguments.

[DBowling]

More Science... More Data... More Truth

As has been discussed earlier...
The Covid-19 related Mortality Rate in the US is 1.8%
The Covid-19 related Mortality Rate in the world is 2.2%

However, the Covid-19 death rate is just the tip of the iceberg and is dwarfed by long term effects on the health of those who contracted the Covid-19 virus.
There is a lot about the long term impact of the Covid-19 virus that is still unknown, but we are beginning to get some preliminary data.

Here are some articles that discuss the long term impact of the Covid-19 virus:

Long-Term Effects of COVID-19
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-nc ... fects.html

The most commonly reported long-term symptoms include:
Fatigue
Shortness of breath
Cough
Joint pain
Chest pain

Other reported long-term symptoms include:
Difficulty with thinking and concentration (sometimes referred to as “brain fog”)
Depression
Muscle pain
Headache
Intermittent fever
Fast-beating or pounding heart (also known as heart palpitations)

More serious long-term complications appear to be less common but have been reported. These have been noted to affect different organ systems in the body. These include:
Cardiovascular: inflammation of the heart muscle
Respiratory: lung function abnormalities
Renal: acute kidney injury
Dermatologic: rash, hair loss
Neurological: smell and taste problems, sleep issues, difficulty with concentration, memory problems
Psychiatric: depression, anxiety, changes in mood

Symptom Duration and Risk Factors for Delayed Return to Usual Health Among Outpatients with COVID-19 in a Multistate Health Care Systems Network — United States, March–June 2020
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6930e1.htm

In a multistate telephone survey of symptomatic adults who had a positive outpatient test result for SARS-CoV-2 infection, 35% had not returned to their usual state of health when interviewed 2–3 weeks after testing. Among persons aged 18–34 years with no chronic medical conditions, one in five had not returned to their usual state of health.

What we know about Long-term effects of COVID-19
https://www.who.int/docs/default-source ... 5d3789a6_2

COVID-19 (coronavirus): Long-term effects
https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-con ... t-20490351

One more quick datapoint...
The number of serious covid vaccine related adverse events in the US from 12/14/20 to 1/13/21 was 640
This gives us a serious covid vaccine reaction rate of 640/13,800,000 = .000046 or 0.0046%

Which shows that a person is orders of magnitude more likely to die from the covid-19 virus (2%)
than to die from the covid-19 vaccine (0.00082%)
or even experience a serious covid-19 vaccine reaction (0.0046%)

[RickD]

DBowling wrote:
More Science... More Data... More Truth

More misinformation...More false Data...More ignoring Truth...

[Fliegender]

But a mortality rate of 2% (2.65 million deaths out of 119 million cases world wide) is not a big deal and we shouldn't really worry about it.

I’m not worried at all. Covid19 isn’t Ebola after all. The Mortality rate for the three North American countries according to John Hopkins University:

Canada 2,5%
USA 1,8%
Mexico 9%

Statistics for European countries (from other credible sources) are similarly all over the place. To be quite blunt, most of the deaths were among people who would have died shortly anyway: the aged, people who were chronically ill and so on. The increase in mortality attributable to Covid19 is somewhere between 9 and 12% depending on the country. That sounds high but - to be blunt again - we should see a decrease in mortality from all sources in the coming years. Covid19 just hurried things along for the weakest and sickest. They got to meet their Maker a little ahead of schedule...

I would have preferred the world react as Sweden did but the World Health Organization recommended a different path which most countries (except Sweden, America and Brazil) followed. The Swedes are a disciplined people and took measures to lessen the impact on their economy and on their healthcare’s system. The USA and Brazil had looney administrations and paid the price in deaths and damage to their economies.

As for mRNA screwing with DNA...there will always be people who should be concerned.

[DBowling]

But a mortality rate of 2% (2.65 million deaths out of 119 million cases world wide) is not a big deal and we shouldn't really worry about it.

I’m not worried at all. Covid19 isn’t Ebola after all.

You may have misunderstood the point I was making...

I was attempting to point out the illogic of the covid denier anti-vax position:
The Covid-19 virus has an average mortality rate of 2% in the world.
But covid deniers don't think we need to worry about it and resist masks, vaccines, and other measures to protect human lives from covid-19.

On the other hand anti-vaxxers get all worried about the Covid-19 vaccine which protects people from the covid virus and is orders of magnitude 'safer' than the Covid-19 virus with a mortality rate of only 0.00082%.
(which is consistent with the all-cause mortality rate)

The illogic of being concerned about something that has a mortality frequency of 0.00082%.
While at the same time displaying a lack of concern about something that has a mortality frequency of 2%.
is truly astounding.

But I guess that's the difference between...
misinformation and conspiracy theories;
and
science, data, and truth.

[RickD]

Here's something to think about...

Some experts estimate the actual number of Covid positive cases in the US is around 100,000,000, including estimates of all untested people, many of whom never had symptoms.

And assuming the cdc number of US Covid deaths(532,355) is accurate, that puts the death rate at .5%. And when we take the number of deaths that were actually from Covid and not something else, the death rate is substantially lower than .5%. And taking into account that the vast majority of deaths are elderly, and those with underlying conditions, that really puts this whole thing into a sobering perspective.

Given the most likely death rate of less than .5%, or less than 5 deaths per 1,000 actual positive cases, and the great majority of those <5 deaths are elderly and those with severe underlying conditions, you can shove your masks and your vaccines where the sun doesn’t shine.

*reposted with correct#s because I have no edit option.

[Fliegender]

But a mortality rate of 2% (2.65 million deaths out of 119 million cases world wide) is not a big deal and we shouldn't really worry about it.

I’m not worried at all. Covid19 isn’t Ebola after all.

You may have misunderstood the point I was making...

I was attempting to point out the illogic of the covid denier anti-vax position:
The Covid-19 virus has an average mortality rate of 2% in the world.
But covid deniers don't think we need to worry about it and resist masks, vaccines, and other measures to protect human lives from covid-19.

On the other hand anti-vaxxers get all worried about the Covid-19 vaccine which protects people from the covid virus and is orders of magnitude 'safer' than the Covid-19 virus with a mortality rate of only 0.00082%.
(which is consistent with the all-cause mortality rate)

The illogic of being concerned about something that has a mortality frequency of 0.00082%.
While at the same time displaying a lack of concern about something that has a mortality frequency of 2%.
is truly astounding.

But I guess that's the difference between...
misinformation and conspiracy theories;
and
science, data, and truth.

Ah, okay. I get it.

Anti-vaxxers get very emotional about the vaccine even though it isn’t imposed on anyone. I suspect many of these people refuse to wear a mask in areas where masks are required. They see it as an infringement on personal liberty. I’ve met a small group of these people and they are the ones who told me about nanorobots. I thought they were joking and burst out laughing...but they were quite serious. I’m not implying that all anti-vaxxers are delusional but they do seem to be given to conspiracy theories to various degrees. The science and the evidence are irrelevant to such people.

On the other hand, AstraZeneca’s recent “problems” seem to have been wholly created-and-encouraged by media reports of thrombosis in 30 people. 30 people out of 5 million vaccinated in Europe. That’s the normal incidence in the general population anyway but since there’s a vaccination campaign going on, any bad news gets people’s attention. To AstraZeneca’s credit, they are reviewing their vaccine and its use has been temporarily suspended in a dozen European countries.

So there’s a lot of emotion and nonsense on both sides.

What about the German/Turk vaccine you received? Have you noticed your right arm suddenly and stiffly raising itself to a 45°angle? Do you have an inexplicable desire to listen to Wagner? To eat sauerkraut?

[DBowling]

Do you have an inexplicable desire to listen to Wagner? To eat sauerkraut?

uh... oh...
Is that a bad thing?

[RickD]

FL wrote:
The science and the evidence are irrelevant to such people.

Says the one who throws out inaccurate data and misleading numbers to back your argument. The hypocrisy is glaring.

If your(both of you) data wasn’t so intentionally misleading I’d chalk you guys up as some pro-vax nutjobs. But the fact that I know both of you enough to know that you should know better, is really quite pathetic.

If you have to use dishonesty to make your points, is it really worth it? You should be looking for truth, not trying to mislead to win arguments.

[Philip]

Rick, when you throw about verbiage like the below -

"Some experts estimate..."

And "assuming the"

"Given the most likely "

such statements are problematic because they are merely of a speculative nature!

[RickD]

Rick, when you throw about verbiage like the below -

"Some experts estimate..."

And "assuming the"

"Given the most likely "

such statements are problematic because they are merely of a speculative nature!

nope. Got the 100,000,000 number from he cdc.
Apparently, the sheep take their word as the gospel.

The true Covid-19 death rate in the US is less than .5%. If you don’t like that %, you could always make up some numbers to try to win an argument. Apparently that’s how it’s done now.